Joined: 15 May 2007 Posts: 774 Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:10 pm Post subject: Re: This ad lost a lot of money.
Bud wrote:
So, now, a shop wants to advertise they use oem parts, and even explains what that means. They advertise factory trained techs, using factory scan tools, scopes, gas anaylizers, accurate alignment and balancing machines, the whole nine yards.
They hire an English teacher to write the ad copy, the wording, so it is done precisely, in proper English. Good art is used. Everything looks great.
Yet their is a very poor response to the ad campaign. It barely pays for itself.
What is wrong?
Hi Bud,
I'll take a stab My though would be clients care more about how a service might benefit them, than how it is performed. I think the same things might be used in a successful campaign with a different approach. For instance, "Our oem scan tools find problems more quickly and accurately, saving you money and time." People don't necessarily buy repair and maintenance, they buy a freedom from future problems and removal of inconvenience.
I think an English teacher might also know far less about writing effective copy than an ad writer. Perfect English is not necessarily effective at getting a message across.
OK, so I see you are in the mood to toss an idea around and joust over it a little.
If you remember from school, your moments of greatest insight came right after your professor made you realize what you thought you knew was, well, shabby.
Everybody knooows that logic prevails. So why didn't housewives, as they were formerly called, not buy the bread in question? They had all the overwhelming evidence in the ads.
Because people don't read ads the way they read textbooks in college. They are free to ignore them. No grades are given for reading ads, so people pass them over if the ads do not immediately strike a note for a presdent problem, pressing need, fear or desire. Bread is boring. Auto repair is boring. Sorry to say it, but it is true. Buying a car repair is not like buying a jet ski, a vacation, or something people want to spend a lot of time reading about.
So they changed the ad strategy and became a national brand. No more talk of ingredients. Lots of bread sold.
Actually this same thing happened with other products. People are slow to accept their ideas for advertising won't work. So they keep running 'ingredient' ads. They kept getting dissapointed.
And shops copy the strategy, and get the same poor results.
Now, to sweeten the waters of argument, Rolls Royce hired an agency, who ran huge print ads that listed tons of ingredients. Technical details galore. Sales boomed from those ads.
So, why does the formula not work for some companies and works for others? What is going on, besides just describing the 'end result?'
Joined: 15 May 2007 Posts: 774 Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 9:05 pm Post subject:
Bud wrote:
OK, so I see you are in the mood to toss an idea around and joust over it a little.
You know me, I'm always in that mood
Bud wrote:
If you remember from school, your moments of greatest insight came right after your professor made you realize what you thought you knew was, well, shabby.
I remember that happening quite frequently.
Bud wrote:
Everybody knooows that logic prevails. So why didn't housewives, as they were formerly called, not buy the bread in question? They had all the overwhelming evidence in the ads.
Because people don't read ads the way they read textbooks in college. They are free to ignore them. No grades are given for reading ads, so people pass them over if the ads do not immediately strike a note for a presdent problem, pressing need, fear or desire. Bread is boring. Auto repair is boring. Sorry to say it, but it is true. Buying a car repair is not like buying a jet ski, a vacation, or something people want to spend a lot of time reading about.
I would only argue, UNLESS, they have been recently burned or have a very strong past memory of dissatisfaction. I would also suggest there are plenty enough such people, with regard to this trade to keep me busy for the next fifty or so years
Bud wrote:
So they changed the ad strategy and became a national brand. No more talk of ingredients. Lots of bread sold.
Actually this same thing happened with other products. People are slow to accept their ideas for advertising won't work. So they keep running 'ingredient' ads. They kept getting dissapointed.
People are slow to accept their ideas about anything are not correct
Bud wrote:
And shops copy the strategy, and get the same poor results.
Now, to sweeten the waters of argument, Rolls Royce hired an agency, who ran huge print ads that listed tons of ingredients. Technical details galore. Sales boomed from those ads.
So, why does the formula not work for some companies and works for others? What is going on, besides just describing the 'end result?'
I know when I bought my first Rolls, I wanted to know all about it before hand I think the same principle can apply in specialized cases, though likely not in everyday consumption of auto service.
A person that just wants an oil change likely isn't interested in very much more than price, location and/or hours. The person who just had an engine toasted by a Goofy Lube that forgot the oil, may very well be. There are also people who are just detail oriented. They might be interested in detail on subjects others find blase'.
In either case, as you say, if the headline doesn’t grab them, “there out of here.”
I believe the two type ads are very different. A promotional ad would be considered a flop unless it makes the phone ring, now. A more institutional approach would be very difficult to measure, except possibly over a long period of time. For instance, a weekly radio program that discussed all the details of auto repair, would be considered a flop, from a promotional standpoint. The phone may not ring every time it airs.
The same program might also help a business establish itself as a quality leader, build top of mind awareness and allow a company to grow 10+ percent annually, when consistently done for fifteen years. Two approaches for two different results? The definition of effectiveness changes with the criteria of measurement?
Joined: 19 May 2007 Posts: 206 Location: Camp Verde, AZ
Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 9:44 pm Post subject:
Bud wrote:
So they changed the ad strategy and became a national brand. No more talk of ingredients. Lots of bread sold.
What did they change the ad too?
Quote:
Now, to sweeten the waters of argument, Rolls Royce hired an agency, who ran huge print ads that listed tons of ingredients. Technical details galore. Sales boomed from those ads.
So, why does the formula not work for some companies and works for others? What is going on, besides just describing the 'end result?'
Could it be that Rolls Royce customers are interested in the technical details? They already have money so they are not price shopping. They already have prestige so they are not looking for something to boost their image. They are not looking to purchase a vehicle the way most of us would. They may be interested in safety, their own, so how thick the bullet proof glass is of interest to them.
The person that the car is for is probably not buying it for themselves, instead an employee is purchasing it. The employee is looking for a vehicle that best meets the specifications of the owner. It would be more like purchasing a tool, we would look at the specs to find the tool that best did what we needed it to do.
_________________ David Wittmayer
Owner / Manager
Hansen Enterprises Fleet Repair, LLC
Camp Verde, AZ
www.hefrshop.com
Joined: 19 May 2007 Posts: 206 Location: Camp Verde, AZ
Posted: Thu Nov 29, 2007 10:28 pm Post subject:
Bud wrote:
It didn't work for bread. The product was not exciting. Likewise, people don't get excited about looking for a new repair shop.
We do not improve anything. The car was running when it came in. The shop changed the oil and flushed the coolant. The car is running when it leaves, big deal.
Or the car was towed in, it gets fixed and drives out. But nothing is really improved, the car is the same as it was before it broke.
Put in a cool DVD player or some fancy wheels and the vehicle is improved. People get excited about improvements.
_________________ David Wittmayer
Owner / Manager
Hansen Enterprises Fleet Repair, LLC
Camp Verde, AZ
www.hefrshop.com
Joined: 15 May 2007 Posts: 774 Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 7:35 am Post subject:
Dave wrote:
We do not improve anything. The car was running when it came in. The shop changed the oil and flushed the coolant. The car is running when it leaves, big deal.
Or the car was towed in, it gets fixed and drives out. But nothing is really improved, the car is the same as it was before it broke.
Put in a cool DVD player or some fancy wheels and the vehicle is improved. People get excited about improvements.
Hi Dave,
I don't think this is necessarily so. A shop changes the oil and gets the person back on track to preventing problems. They explain why the "correct" oil is not only better for the engine, it can prevent catalytic converter problems. Why this filter is better than the one that had been used. The shop can now get the client on a scheduled maintenance program and prevent future problems.
The client leaves more knowledgeable, satisfied and yes, excited. They tell their friends how different the shop is and you make an extra $200,000 this year.
Then again, Louis, I dissagree with you on that. It is not fair to compare your type of business to a typical repair shop. What works for you only does so because of all the hundreds of other things different about your business.
We have seen that shops that copy one aspect of AGCO find that it doesn't work wonders for them.
Joined: 15 May 2007 Posts: 774 Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posted: Fri Nov 30, 2007 6:27 pm Post subject:
Bud wrote:
Then again, Louis, I dissagree with you on that. It is not fair to compare your type of business to a typical repair shop. What works for you only does so because of all the hundreds of other things different about your business.
We have seen that shops that copy one aspect of AGCO find that it doesn't work wonders for them.
Hi Bud,
AH, but I didn't mention my shop, rather A SHOP can do these things. I think it is a misconception that repair work is inherently uninteresting. Instead I believe the majority have become dis-interested in their businesses and thus the work they perform. The excitement is not in the work it is in those that perform it. An alignment, transmission service or even an oil change can be made more interesting, with little effort. They may even [dare I say this] be made fun
Joined: 15 May 2007 Posts: 774 Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 8:40 am Post subject:
Bud wrote:
Ok, Louis, can you give a few examples of ordinary repair shops that implemented some of those things, with success?
Hi Bud,
Please accept this response with the greatest respect that I do have for you and what you are saying. I apologize for not being more direct, I am not disputing what you say, I did it to try to bring out a point. The point is we are all ordinary repair shops until we implement those and other things. There is not one thing in the world, other than possibly fear, that keeps any shop on this planet from working towards improvement and becoming different.
Going back to the original post:
louis wrote:
I don't think this is necessarily so. A shop changes the oil and gets the person back on track to preventing problems. They explain why the "correct" oil is not only better for the engine, it can prevent catalytic converter problems. Why this filter is better than the one that had been used. The shop can now get the client on a scheduled maintenance program and prevent future problems.
The client leaves more knowledgeable, satisfied and yes, excited. They tell their friends how different the shop is and you make an extra $200,000 this year.
Excitement is where you create it
What is there in this post that any shop could not do if they care to? What is required is simply a bit of enthusiasm for the job and a bit of knowledge of the products being sold.
I think it is a mistake to look at any shop that has achieved a measure of success, by using different methods and assuming something is different about the shop. There is nothing I have ever done that cannot be achieved by anyone else, willing to put in the effort.
Joined: 19 May 2007 Posts: 206 Location: Camp Verde, AZ
Posted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 1:55 pm Post subject:
Let me try to make my point a little differently. We buy cars to use, they wear out, and we get another one. People know that by doing maintenance to them we can extend their life expectancy and prevent break downs.
I do not think that the average person, new to a town, wakes up on a Saturday mourning all excited about finding a new shop to service their vehicle. The maintenance or repair work that needs done is just going to delay the inevitable ( a worn out car ). In their mind, nothing on the car is going to be improved by changing the oil.
Installing a DVD player or custom wheels will improve the vehicle. It now has something it did not have before. People can easily get excited about improvements. "Tomarrow mourning we are going to go shopping for a new DVD player! Lets compare features to see which one we want to buy."
The average person can get excited abut the size of the DVD screen, does it have surround sound, how may speakers, and how many watts do they put out. Most people do not get excited about deciding between Penzoil 10w30, Valvoline 10w30, or Chevron 10w30 oils.
It would seem to me, that in regards to advertising and marketing we need to approach people a little differently if we have a boring product vs. an exciting one.
Take Christmas trees for example. In December these are an exciting thing to buy. The advertising, for the most part, is not to get people to buy one, but rather which one to buy. Should it be tall or short, real or artificial, Blue Spruce or Jack Pine, Alive or Cut, do we cut it ourselves or get it already cut down? In December anybody can sell Christmas trees and make money.
Try to sell Christmas trees in June and the advertising would have to be done differently. Christmas trees in June would be a boring product. They can be sold this time of year but it would take some thinking outside the box.
Louis, I believe you have taken a boring product and worked at making it exciting. You have educated people, raised their standards and expectations. To do that you have not followed the traditional automotive shop model for advertising and marketing.
_________________ David Wittmayer
Owner / Manager
Hansen Enterprises Fleet Repair, LLC
Camp Verde, AZ
www.hefrshop.com
Joined: 15 May 2007 Posts: 774 Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 2:46 pm Post subject:
Dave wrote:
Let me try to make my point a little differently. We buy cars to use, they wear out, and we get another one. People know that by doing maintenance to them we can extend their life expectancy and prevent break downs.
I do not think that the average person, new to a town, wakes up on a Saturday mourning all excited about finding a new shop to service their vehicle. The maintenance or repair work that needs done is just going to delay the inevitable ( a worn out car ). In their mind, nothing on the car is going to be improved by changing the oil.
They may be quite excited to learn about extending the line between purchase and replacement, as well as lowering the cost along the way. The oil change is merely an instrument to that end, along with many other things. I am yet to meet a person that does not care about saving money.
The thing I believe, most often prevents this is the client does not trust the shop to suggest what is in the client’s best interest. Rather, they expect the shop to act in their own best interest, counter to theirs. This feeling comes from decades of such experiences and is well documented.
Dave wrote:
Installing a DVD player or custom wheels will improve the vehicle. It now has something it did not have before. People can easily get excited about improvements. "Tomarrow mourning we are going to go shopping for a new DVD player! Lets compare features to see which one we want to buy."
Proper maintenance also improves the vehicle and has the added value of continuing to save money into the future. A shop that thinks they sell oil changes and transmission services, etc. is missing the boat. Instead they should be selling a lack of future problems and a huge savings of money. Now that’s exciting
Dave wrote:
The average person can get excited abut the size of the DVD screen, does it have surround sound, how may speakers, and how many watts do they put out. Most people do not get excited about deciding between Penzoil 10w30, Valvoline 10w30, or Chevron 10w30 oils.
The get real excited when it’s explained why the engine should have 5W20 and the last guy put 10W30, believe me, I see it everyday. Most shops simply have never taken the effort to make this exciting.
Dave wrote:
It would seem to me, that in regards to advertising and marketing we need to approach people a little differently if we have a boring product vs. an exciting one.
Or take what we feel is boring and make it exciting
Dave wrote:
Take Christmas trees for example. In December these are an exciting thing to buy. The advertising, for the most part, is not to get people to buy one, but rather which one to buy. Should it be tall or short, real or artificial, Blue Spruce or Jack Pine, Alive or Cut, do we cut it ourselves or get it already cut down? In December anybody can sell Christmas trees and make money.
Try to sell Christmas trees in June and the advertising would have to be done differently. Christmas trees in June would be a boring product. They can be sold this time of year but it would take some thinking outside the box.
That’s not the same at all, in December there is a need in June there is not. This is the reason nurseries sell other things the rest of the year. In August, in Louisiana air conditioning repair is not hard to sell. In February it is very difficult. Has little to do with excitement, it’s just the need is less.
In February a person that explains why just putting a compressor on or topping off the system is wrong, and why, can still generate more sales than a shop that simply quotes prices. It’s about demonstrating why the shop is the client’s better choice. “Even though my price is twice as much, your overall cost will be much lower, here’s why . . .”
Dave wrote:
Louis, I believe you have taken a boring product and worked at making it exciting. You have educated people, raised their standards and expectations. To do that you have not followed the traditional automotive shop model for advertising and marketing.
Thank you, that is quite a compliment. I think it also suggest the point I wish to make. Following the traditional automotive shop model is not what clients want any longer. This is evidenced by the steady decline in the number of and financial condition of most such shops. At the same time, there are shops that are growing, gaining clients and making a good living. Perhaps it is time to cast the old model aside and listen to the market. People are largely fed up with the auto repair trade as it has existed. Many people would prefer to drive with a problem or spend money on a new vehicle rather than deal with it.
I don’t think anyone is destined to stay as they are. For instance, no one need say this won’t work in the average shop. Rather let’s work to be above average. My goal has never been to be the best auto repair shop, it has always been to be the first, something new and much better. Anyone else can do the same, it merely takes vision and dedication to the process.
Dave, I believe, from reading your post that you too are such a shop. I don’t think you would be here if you weren’t. Never let the shackles of mediocrity hold you back from what can be. Thanks Dave, I appreciate your input and the opportunity to state my position to you.
Somehow I don't see what the conflict is about. I thought you were saying that a humdrum business can implement a few simple changes and see big results.
Just buy the changes, maybe hire a consultant.
Of course not. Now implement 100 simple changes over one year, that's another story.
Joined: 15 May 2007 Posts: 774 Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 4:05 pm Post subject:
Bud wrote:
Somehow I don't see what the conflict is about. I thought you were saying that a humdrum business can implement a few simple changes and see big results.
Just buy the changes, maybe hire a consultant.
Of course not. Now implement 100 simple changes over one year, that's another story.
Hi Bud,
I apologize if I gave that impression. No, a humdrum business will not be able to fake it. At the same time what I am saying is there is no reason for a business to be humdrum.
Auto repair is only thought boring because it has been allowed to portrayed as such over a long period of time. Rather than excepting repair is boring and should be promoted as such, why not work to make it interesting. It is not that hard and the results can be astounding.
Joined: 15 May 2007 Posts: 774 Location: Baton Rouge, LA
Posted: Sat Dec 01, 2007 6:02 pm Post subject:
Bud wrote:
Oh. OK. Man, these threads can get offtrack really fast.
And you know, I find that's where some of the best lessons are learned. I think that's the beauty of a forum. Now if we could just get more people to hop on in . . .
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My though would be clients care more about how a service might benefit them, than how it is performed. I think the same things might be used in a successful campaign with a different approach. For instance, "Our oem scan tools find problems more quickly and accurately, saving you money and time." People don't necessarily buy repair and maintenance, they buy a freedom from future problems and removal of inconvenience.
